Take or make?

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by ell on November 10, 2009 at 9:01pm

People who just take pic's at family gatherings, save it on their pc's and dont persue perfection are "snapshot shooters"
With the advancement in technology I think we can all be photographers (in the making) even without having to alter all the pic's you take.
Some pics one takes don't need altering.....you are the person that directed the camera in the right position at the right time.....thus MAKING a photo that inspires......aking photo after photo from different positions to get THE one!

Permalink Reply by Randall Sherman on November 11, 2009 at 1:03am

Hi Elaine! Thanks for your input. Before my comments a few days ago, everything in this group was many months old -- perhaps now we can kindle a lively analysis of the goal of good photography. As I wrote earlier, it is a long road from the "aha moment" when we first decide to lift our camera until our viewer feels our message. My point in this forum is that the click of the shutter is NOT the end of that road but is just a way point along the way. I agree if we take enough shots and get all the various settings and choices right the click can be near the end of the road. But, I can't agree that taking further steps is wrong or de-values our image. I see no reason to value an "unaltered" image over an "altered" image.

Permalink Reply by ell on November 11, 2009 at 9:08am

Im not against altering images at all but really don't like altering a image to the point of it looking fake.....some of the advice I got from the criticism section....for instance....making an image POP.....what does that exactly mean......changing the colors etc in such a way that it looks unnatural? I do think that many of my pics needs some editing but would like to do it in such a way that it still looks natural......so I don't think its the end of the road after you click the shutter......I just think planning and taking the pic is the beginning and a very crucial point to the success of your photograph.....you can take photographs that cannot be fixed with altering.
If u took a great shot and it does not need altering......why should you alter it and place more value to that?
Its still your work.....altered or unaltered.......havnt you taken any pic's that you thought doesnt need any altering except maybe for some cropping?
I would like to know how you alter your photographs as they do still look natural.....the way I would like mine to look

Permalink Reply by Randall Sherman on November 11, 2009 at 9:43am

Precisely! The more we plan BEFORE clicking the shutter, the better we are as photographers! And, when we happen across that truly average scene that matches in color, contrast, tonal range etc. what our in-camera processor expects, we will achieve a capture that requires little or no work after downloading. But, we can not forget the image on the LCD display is NOT the photon count the sensor reported pixel by pixel, color by color to the processor chip in our camera! Nope! Even that first image is already heavily processed by an algorithm that relies soley on averages! But, in my case, I rarely choose an "average" compostion. I seem to be attracted instead to strong colors, harsh contrasts and/or long tonal range images. In fact, this is so often the case that I have given up entirely on letting the in-camera processor do my post-processing and now I shoot exclusively in RAW so it is always me who decides how my pre-visualization can best be achieved via post-capture processing.

Permalink Reply by Pat Tauzin on November 24, 2009 at 5:24pm

Im very new to photography and I feel I need to learn to take a good photograph before I start manipulating them to the point of creating the photo post click and therefore never learn how to take a great shot.

Permalink Reply by Randall Sherman on November 24, 2009 at 8:59pm

Hi Pat! Welcome to PictureSocial! I believe the key phrase in your observation is "manipulating them to the point of creating the photo." We have all seen "photos" where lay people exclaim "looks just like a painting"! If the "looks like a painting" photo is the photo we are excluding with "no post capture" editing, I agree with you and everyone in this group 100%. But, my point is very different. I am not espousing turning photos into paintings. I am advocating presenting your very best. Quite frankly, I have no interest in shots best filed in a shoebox deep in the recesses of a back closet. What I am saying is "put your best foot forward." We don't run out to work naked and we shouldn't send our photos out naked either. Lets take a shower, shave and dress before presenting ourselves in public. Ditto for our photos! I am NOT saying go to the plastic surgeon -- just be clean and presentable. Your second key phrase is "I need to learn to take a good photograph." So true! We all need to learn that. But, why end the learning experience with clicking the shutter? That moment of image capture is just a step along the way. A very important step but most certainly not the last step any more than it should be the first step. I think my long-winded harangue has reached its conclusion now. I believe, to restate the mission of this group is to say "leave no stone unturned" BEFORE pressing the shutter! Certain things are difficult and perhaps even impossible to do in PhotoShop. Depth of field, motion blur, background "merges," and indeed perspective are examples. So, let's restate it: "I want to learn to control all those things that can not be edited post-capture." That is far different from saying "I don't want to make any post-capture adjustments."

Permalink Reply by Randall Sherman on December 4, 2009 at 5:15pm

Hi Elaine! In the weeks since we chatted on "Unaltered" I have refined my understanding of the important role that group has undertaken. I now see it as a "previsualization" goal -- seeing and completing as much of the photo as possible with the click of the shutter. Indeed there are many things that need to be done before the click that can't reasonably be done after the click -- like cutting off the person's head in a portrait as an extreme example.
Anyway, in all the thinking, I missed your request for information on how I "alter" my photos and your nice compliment. Thank you for the compliment! I mostly limit myself to working with the elements -- exposure (overall, highlight, mid-tone and shadow), contrast, clarity, vibrance and saturation. I use LightRoom which breaks these elements down to a set of sliders that allows "what you see is what you get" adjustments of these elements in a very logic and chronologically correct order.
This is all I do to 99% of my photos but our local annual photo contest has a "photo-art" division. For these photos I take my LightRoom image to PhotoShop and apply Topaz filters. Because of the contest category I have to be sure the end result "looks like a painting" lol
Hope everything is good for you in South Africa